What's worse than death?

[Sacred Guardian]

yes, i think that would be bad for him, but, to accomplish a world like that voldemort must be eliminated, but i don't think that being forgotten is worse than death, because i guess to be forgotten, at least how i take you mean it you would neet to be dead to be forgotten, so you wouldn't really care

[bludy mery]

I have a fealing Harry will die maybe because JK said that maybe there won't be books after harry leaves hogwarts

[Marcus Baker]

Just because there are no book, dosent mean harry will die. Kids reading the book want a happy ending with harry living, not dieing.

[AccioNiffler]

Kids may want a happy ending, but it's not just kids reading the books. a lot of people that have read the books since the first one came out arent kids anymore. And who's to say if Harry dies it'll be a bad thing? Maybe it'll be sad at first but then later just inspires all the people he knew to graet things (or maybe something less corny than that...lol).

Personally I think that in LV eyes, being beaten by Harry would be worse than death. It would shame him and disgrace him. I dont know, just a thought

[redhead2531]

Being beaten by Harry is something LV should get used to huh? Even time they meet Harry comes out on top. But Harry never has actually beaten him, because he is still out and about terrorizing the wizard world. So ya being finally beat by Harry will be worse for LV.

[HuffleDuck]

This question is tough. According to HP books it would be tough question, but in real world worse than death is pain.

[choki]

real life pain...that will be losing a loved one...
that is the pain and emotion harry felt that drove voldemort away

[bludy mery]

Smart point!!! but it has to be something more special... something that dosn't contain love and stufff... that will be to much expected

[choki]

hmmm....maybe getting hit back by his own avada kedavra will do the trick...

Voldemort: Now i shall finally get rid of u, Harry Potter...
Harry: Yeah try it then...Half-blood
Voldemort: Avada Kedavra...Arghhhhhhh
Harry: Hmmm, that is a new discovery...a mirror is able to defect that killer curse...papa and mama should have more mirrors at home 16 years ago

(I'm being lame)

[justin]

Men are not prisoners of fate, but only prisoners of their own minds. Franklin D. Roosevelt

The only real prison is fear, and the only real freedom is freedom from fear. Aung San Suu Kyi

While you are not able to serve men, how can you serve spirits [of the dead]?...While you do not know life, how can you know about death? Confucius

Do not fear death so much, but rather the inadequate life. Bertolt Brecht

As a well-spent day brings happy sleep, so life well used brings happy death. Leonardo da Vinci

Ok well I could keep going, but these quotes are sufficient.

I believe the fate worse than death in a word is, hell. I don't think it is Hell, the place we think of, but I believe it is a place or existence so horrible that it will be much worse than death.

I believe either in Book 6 or 7 we will get JKR's explination of the "after-life." There is a "heaven" waiting for the characters in her books. Nick said that there is a choice that wizards face, he was fearful of death so part of him stayed back here. He says that Sirius "...will not come back. He will have...gone on." So somewhere after the physical act of dying there is a barrier or decision that makes the leap from a ghost life to another life.

Voldemort obviously thinks of one thing, power. So the thing he fears is halt to the pursuit of that power. I think what Voldemort doesn't realise is that death is not the end. He thinks that he will be able to recover from anything and that he will always have a fighting chance, but there is a consciousness after death. For him after death will be an eternity to be trapped with no hope. He will realise that his life has been inadequate and "lifeless". Truely that would be a terrible punishment for any man.

Anywho, just some thoughts.

On slightly different note, to make a legitimate ending of Voldemort, how could he be distroyed in a way where no one would fear him coming back? I imagine it is going to have to be a very "violent" way, not simply a flash of light. Otherwise he "could" come back in everybody minds and his power over the world would remain. By violent I don't mean gory, but a death that looks like a terrible way to die.

Let me know what you think, but one thing is for sure, JKR will explain what happens after death (there was too big of a cliffhanger when Nick wouldn't answer Harry).

[highsorcerer]

Do you think the dead we love ever truly leave us?

-- Dumbledore, PoA

There is nothing worse than death.

Lord Voldemort, OotP

Nick couldn't answer Harry because he made the choice to remain in a feeble imitation of life, instead of going on. I think JKR has stated that the happiest people do not become ghosts. Sirius was not the happiest of wizards (he had traded one prison for another), but he had something to look for once he went beyond the veil. He'd be with James again. He might have had nothing else but that (he hated his family, and of the two living friends he had at Hogwarts, one was a traitor who murdered innocents and left him to take the blame). Just as Harry's thoughts of love for Sirius drove out Voldemort, Sirius will know that Harry will join him someday.

[AccioNiffler]

Justin-- Great post, I agree with a lot of what you said, it made a lot of sense and your explained it well

highsorcerer-- I agree with you on the ghost thing, and also that Sirius knew that he would be with James, and Harry some day too, so that's why he died and didn't become a ghost.

good point both of you

[jonny5]

Dumbledore did say that there are things worse than death. I too think he means pain and soulessness. I know he would never set a dementor on someone and its also plainly obvious that he would not stoop to the unforgivable curses. Remember what Lupin said about the Dementors Kiss? 'Does anyone really deserve that?' I bet he and Dumbledore are of the same mind. Now to my thoughts on the matter. I think the key to all of this is Dumbledore's initial spell - the one that Voldemort countered with the shield. To someone that is driven by supreme power and control, what could be the worse than death. I think that to Voldemort, a sould that knows no companionship and no love death is the worst thing - so i think the perspective that we need to seek out is Dumbledore's. What would be worse than death to Dumbledore? I think the death of everyone around him. I think that if dumbledore were cut off from emotion, cut off from all that he loves - people, society, magic, warm socks (he he he), he would consider that much worse than death. So how does this apply to Voldemort? I think that Dumbledore wants to imprison Voldemort from power, from magic, and from followers... to Voldemort, that would be worse than death - perhaps DD just wants Voldemort to rot away in jail, powerless. A fate worse than death? Unfortunately, i dont think he can be imprisoned - so harry will just have to finish him off (sorry for the huge post, just had a bit to say)

[highsorcerer]

A key difference between Tom and Dumbledore is that Dumbledore admits that there are things worse than death. Tom doesn't. So Dumbledore fights bravely secure in his knowledge that he's right. Even if he dies, Harry will live to continue the fight, and even if Harry dies, he knows everything was hopeless all long. Dumbleodore admits there are things beyond him, and reinterates that choices, not fate, determine what a wizard will be.

Dumbledore admits he can't see the mistakes of youth. While he wanted Harry to be happy and proud of what he has done, he always feared Harry wasn't up to the final fate he had to choose. It was always Dumbledore's greatest fear that Harry would defeat Voldemort by becoming more powerful than he was, and taking his place, he wouldn't select evil as his power base. However, by the end of book 5, he knows Harry won't turn to evil and in hindsight, admits he should have trained Harry all along.

In the end, Harry discards earthly pleasures (winning the house cup) for greater ideals. He has alerted the world to Voldemort's return, but at his own terrible cost. He wants people more alerted to their own dangers that his own life. Even earthly pleausres, such as the admiration and love of Cho Chang, his own first crush, means nothing to him in face of danger. Harry puts his faith in his friends, and is ultimately proved right.

Ultimatley, Harry duels with every dark force he has ever seen in his life. He pressured the sorting hat, and won. He took on Tom Riddle, and won. He took on Siruis Black, and won. He took on Lord voldemort and won. He took on dementors, and won. He even took on the Dursley's and won.

[AccioNiffler]

Wow, those are two really good posts. I dont really know what else to add... ummm... two thumbs up for jonny5 and highsorcerer